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From: MrMoped on 9 Feb 2007 02:26 "Knobdoodle" <knobdoodle(a)hotmail.com> wrote in message news:NdFyh.4669$sd2.1501(a)news-server.bigpond.net.au... > > "MrMoped" <MrMoped49(a)hotmail.com> wrote: >> Simple physics really! When switched on, the headlamp assembly pushes the >> light beams forward (this is particularly noticable in the absence of >> daylight), this is called an action. So using Newtons third law which >> states that for every action there must be an equal and opposite >> reaction, the same force applied by the headlamp to push the light beams >> is then also applied to the vehicle, pushing it back! Extra petrol is >> used to overcome the force applied by the headlamps. >> > [applause] > But you've got red ones pushing you from behind and EVERYONE knows red > ones are faster! > -- > Clem True, as a general rule the red ones are faster and this has been a concern to (most) motorcycle manufacturers worldwide. Having a fast red light at the rear of the motorcycle was a huge concern in the early days of motorcycling as it was soon realised that having a fast light (red) at the rear and a not-so-fast light at the front led to the rear of the motorcycle trying to overtake the front at every opportuity - this was deemed to be "not rider friendly". To counteract the power of the red light, a very mild or low wattage light was fitted to the rear whilst a stronger/higher wattage light was fitted to the front. This has worked very well. The ratio between front and rear light is very sensitive. A typical setup of 60/55 watt high/low beam front light to 5 watt tail light works well in most situations but the addition of a 20 watt brake light has added an element of danger by making the motorcycle unstable. If you require proof of tis, try the following: - ride along (at any speed) with the mind in neutral and then apply the front brake as hard as you possibly can and do not ease off under any circumstances. The rear of the motorcycle will rise and continue rising until the red, rear light has overtaken the front. Some will try and attribute this phenomenon to the action of the brakes but that is not 100% correct. Squeezing the front brake as hard as you can imparts maximum energy to the faster red light. A similar effect can be achieved by applying maximum force to the rear brake. So yes the red lights are the fastest but they can be tamed with some (un)sound engineering practices so as not to detract from the motorcycling experience.
From: G-S on 9 Feb 2007 02:27 Nev.. wrote: > G-S wrote: >> Nev.. wrote: >>> GB wrote: >>>> "Nev.." <idiot(a)mindless.com> wrote in >>>> news:45ca4f55$0$25321$5a62ac22(a)per-qv1-newsreader-01.iinet.net.au: >>>>> And you very neatly ignored the bit where I also found that it did not >>>>> affect the fuel flow and therefore did not use any more fuel... no >>>>> wait.. you poo-poo'd that because it didn't suit your argument. BZZT. >>>> >>>> I didn't ignore it at all. In fact I addressed it quite >>>> comprehensively. Your fuel flow meter is not up to the task of >>>> measuring fuel flow with sufficient accuracy or repeatability >>>> to demonstrate the so-fundamental-that-it-shouldn't-need-discussing,- >>>> much-less-demonstrating principle of physics that's being discussed. >>> >>> So for all intents and purposes, the amount of additional fuel >>> consumed when the headlights are turned on is immeasurable, so this >>> "lights on = more fuel" business exists in theory only. >>> >> >> _Not_ immeasurable... just not measurable by a standard car >> consumption gauge. >> >> We have flow rate meters at work that are sensitive enough to measure >> this effect. > > So does my car. It doesn't measure any change. > > Nev.. > '04 CBR1100XX If your car flow rate meter was sensitive enough to measure this effect then it would show the change (which exists) and since it doesn't show any change it follows logically that the effect on you car consumption is too small to be measured by your cars flow rate meter :) G-S
From: G-S on 9 Feb 2007 02:32 Theo Bekkers wrote: > jlittler(a)my-deja.com wrote: > >> (ceteris paribus), > > What kind of a bus is that? > >> (2) still not sure I'm explaining that particularly well > > Those of us that agreed with you understood it. > > Theo > > Indeed. G-S
From: Andrew McKenna on 9 Feb 2007 03:28 jlittler(a)my-deja.com wrote: <--- snipperage ---> > > And your statement is indeed correct - there's a difference between > the mechanical input and the mechanical load. Pure semantics of > course. mechanical load (as torque) plus electrical load(as torque) > equals mechanical input required(as torque). The mechanical load is a > constant (ceteris paribus), the electrical load changes with, well, > the electrical load <grin> (1). To be more accurate the torque/turning > force that you have to provide to generate a current equal to the > current being drawn is increased as the current required increases(2) > > > JL > (1) there obviously being more than one meaning of the word load in > this context - one being current drawn, the other being turning force > required > (2) still not sure I'm explaining that particularly well I wasn't going to shove my oar in again but that's such a good translation I can't resist it. Of course you have to spin the electricity generating thing faster if you want more electricity, nobody's arguing that you don't. What I was saying was that the increased electrical load does not cause engine RPM to drop, because it can't. Simple test: drive a test vehicle (use Nev's) to a stadium with lights and connect lights to a light circuit on the test vehicle (don't ask me how, there seem to be a gadmillion electrical geniuses in here, you lot figure it out). Step 2: turn on lights. If I'm wrong the test vehicle will stall. If I'm right the lights won't come on but the test vehicle will run normally. -- Cheers Andrew
From: Toosmoky on 9 Feb 2007 04:29
Andrew McKenna wrote: > Simple test: drive a test vehicle (use Nev's) to a stadium with lights > and connect lights to a light circuit on the test vehicle No need. Our generators at work drop revs and sound as if they're under load instantly when we turn on spotlights connected to them. There's no doubt they'd be using more fuel. Of course, whether that's a "waste" of petrol depends on your point of view. I'm Toosmoky and that's my two bob's worth. -- Toosmoky Work to ride, Ride to Work... http://toosmoky.d2.net.au |