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From: Champ on 26 Apr 2010 18:36 On Mon, 26 Apr 2010 22:29:28 +0000 (UTC), wessie <putmynamehere(a)tesco.net> wrote: >>> Immobiliser? >> >> Is there one? If so how did I start it before? >Yes. On a ZZR600 it's called the side stand switch. IIRC they are very >temperamental and most people I knew[1] with one bypassed it. As I said elsewhere - if it was that, the starter wouldn't turn over. -- Champ We declare that the splendor of the world has been enriched by a new beauty: the beauty of speed. ZX10R | Hayabusa | GPz750turbo neal at champ dot org dot uk
From: wessie on 26 Apr 2010 18:40 Champ <news(a)champ.org.uk> wrote in news:5a5ct59aatcdo0bvcghcah6tuthe4edp79@ 4ax.com: > On Mon, 26 Apr 2010 22:29:28 +0000 (UTC), wessie > <putmynamehere(a)tesco.net> wrote: > >>>> Immobiliser? >>> >>> Is there one? If so how did I start it before? > >>Yes. On a ZZR600 it's called the side stand switch. IIRC they are very >>temperamental and most people I knew[1] with one bypassed it. > > As I said elsewhere - if it was that, the starter wouldn't turn over. I thought it only cut the ignition, same as the kill switch -- wessie at tesco dot net BMW R1150GS
From: Lozzo on 26 Apr 2010 18:48 wessie wrote: > Champ <news(a)champ.org.uk> wrote in > news:5a5ct59aatcdo0bvcghcah6tuthe4edp79@ 4ax.com: > > > On Mon, 26 Apr 2010 22:29:28 +0000 (UTC), wessie > > <putmynamehere(a)tesco.net> wrote: > > > >>>> Immobiliser? > >>> > >>> Is there one? If so how did I start it before? > > > > > Yes. On a ZZR600 it's called the side stand switch. IIRC they are > > > very temperamental and most people I knew[1] with one bypassed it. > > > > As I said elsewhere - if it was that, the starter wouldn't turn > > over. > > I thought it only cut the ignition, same as the kill switch It does, and as soon as you move the clutch out when in 1st gear[1] it cuts the engine if the sidestand is left down. You can start a ZZR1100 on the sidestand and wait for it to warm up a bit before moving off, in fact I can't think of any bike that won't allow this. On most makes you have to pull the clutch in while the starter is pressed, but not on Kawasakis [1] You can't select 2nd from a standstill on a ZZR1100 because of the wonderful Kawasaki Positive Neutral Finder. -- Lozzo Versys 650 Tourer, CBR600F-W racebike in the making, TS250C, RD400F (somewhere)
From: Pete Fisher on 27 Apr 2010 02:50 In communiqu� <kd4ct51ucnjg0t8vhfhmbjpn847lnrnb3b(a)4ax.com>, Champ <news(a)champ.org.uk> cast forth these pearls of wisdom >On Mon, 26 Apr 2010 22:11:27 +0100, "malc" ><malwhite1(a)blueyonder.co.uk> wrote: > >>Rode the ZZR into work on Friday and back home no problem. When I went to >>give the eldest lad a spin on it 2 hours later the solenoid would chatter >>but the starter motor wouldn't spin. Tried it with jump leads off the car >>the next day and it started beautifully. Must be the battery I thought. Went >>to Frazers, got new battery, charged it and put it in. Lo and behold, lots >>of spinning engine but no ignition. It coughed a couple of times but >>steadfastly refuses to start. In fact there's not even a cough now. >> >>The dealer is coming to collect it for repair but is there something obvious >>I'm missing? I can't see any loose wires, the battery is the right way >>round - negative goes to earth. Definitely petrol getting through because I >>can smell it. I haven't got the Haynes manual in the post yet so I 'm a bit >>stuck. > >The fact that engine is turning over ok rules out most electrical >issues - any problems with the sidestand cut out, etc, stop the >starter circuit itself. > >Did you have to lift the tank up at all to fit the battery? If so, >could you have disturbed the fuel pipe, or <ahem> turned the fuel off >and forgotten to turn it back on? > >My best guess, from the description above, is that if you can smell >petrol, I suspect that you have flooded it. But you say elsewhere >that you tried it a day later, and get the same problem. Did it >usually start OK? Have you followed your usual starting procedure >(i.e. using choke, closed or part open throttle, etc)? > > Perhaps an 'extra' connection on the battery posts that has been missed when fitting the battery? Nordwests have such a gotcha. A thin cable that connects to the positive terminal in addition to the main cable. Not usually a problem unless doing a rebuild etc. when it may get pushed out of the way and forgotten when the time comes to hook up the battery again. If it's not connected the starter will spin the motor, over but there will be no spark. More easily diagnosed though because it's not that difficult to get the plug out and check for a spark. I'm also wondering about the possibility of a fuse that might have blown as the jump leads were removed. As you say however, it's hard to think of one that would only kill the ignition system. In any case the odd cough suggests that there may have been a spark of some kind, which suggests flooding. Lozzo's procedure is pretty much what Voxan recommend in such eventuality, with the addition of slowly closing the throttle while cranking it over with the choke off, until it catches. But that's FI. I really don't like bikes that you can't relatively easily check for a spark on, even by pulling a plug cap off and using a spare plug. <Looks at Voxan and crosses fingers> -- +-------------------------------------------------------------------+ | Pete Fisher at Home: Peter(a)ps-fisher.demon.co.uk | | Voxan Roadster Yamaha WR250Z/Supermoto "Old Gimmer's Hillclimber" | | Gilera GFR * 2 Moto Morini 2C/375 Morini 350 "Forgotten Error" | +-------------------------------------------------------------------+
From: Pip Luscher on 27 Apr 2010 03:15
On Tue, 27 Apr 2010 07:50:49 +0100, Pete Fisher <Peter(a)ps-fisher.demon.co.uk> wrote: >Perhaps an 'extra' connection on the battery posts that has been missed >when fitting the battery? Nordwests have such a gotcha. A thin cable >that connects to the positive terminal in addition to the main cable. That was one of my thoughts. I think my Guzzi Quota takes the prize with at least three three separate eyelets that connect to the positive terminal and two on the negative - a braided strap and a loom ground. And none of the positive ones is an extra feature or alarm - they're all standard wiring. >Not usually a problem unless doing a rebuild etc. when it may get pushed >out of the way and forgotten when the time comes to hook up the battery >again. If it's not connected the starter will spin the motor, over but >there will be no spark. More easily diagnosed though because it's not >that difficult to get the plug out and check for a spark. On said Quota the bike was supplied with the loom ground floating, so the indicator flash rate varied according to whether the headlight ws on or not. I put this down to it being a Guzzi at the time; it was my first Italian bike after all. I found out when I disconnected the speedo drive to get at the instrument bulbs... and the headlight stopped working. >I really don't like bikes that you can't relatively easily check for a >spark on, even by pulling a plug cap off and using a spare plug. Me neither. -- -Pip |