Some Car Dealers Will Never Change
in [Motorcycles]
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From: don (Calgary) on 14 Mar 2010 12:46 On Sun, 14 Mar 2010 10:07:43 +0000, totallydeadmailbox(a)yahoo.co.uk (The Older Gentleman) wrote: >don (Calgary) <hd.flhr(a)telus.net> wrote: > >> Some countries manage to enjoy universal health coverage along with >> very generous social programs, without having their citizens pay an >> onerous and punitive road tax. > >Name three of comparable size? By area or population? Both impact the delivery cost of health care and social programs. In fact these programs are far more efficient and cost effective when dealing with medium or high population densities as opposed to very low densities spread out over millions of hectares. We enjoy universal health care and a host of social programs and do so without collecting taxes under the guise of GW and redirecting those funds to social programs. >Social programmes have to be paid for >somehow, unless the country is so amazingly wealthy that government >revenues can afford to pay for such programmes with no contribution from >the citizens. We are all taxed. The only difference is by how much and where are those taxes directed. The economic health of a country is largely affected by the tax system. Tax the hell out of job producing business and guess what, those job producing businesses will move on. The wealth of a country is directly related to how well it is run. It is conceivable some countries are better run than the UK and realize the benefits in lower and less onerous taxes all the while retaining the basic social programs. > >I can't actually think of any country with an equivalent population to >the UK's that fits this bill. I expect some small states with massive >oil revenues manage it[1], but that's hardly representative. Speaking of Canada up until the last ten years or so only Alberta has enjoyed the direct benefit of oil production. Since natural resources are owned by the Provinces funds derived directly from those resources flow to the Province. The national government does not receive royalties on the oil production. Canada is far from what I would describe as a wealthy country, yet we do enjoy a universal health care program. Granted we do not have the population of the UK, but as I noted above the lack of huge population centres creates our own financial challenges. Regardless once a country passes a certain population threshold the income/expense equation tends to balance out. More people equals more income and increased expenses. > > >> I think the UK road tax is as clear of >> an example as I have seen, of a government using the global warming >> hysteria as a cash grab. > >I wouldn't disagree. > >> What would be more disturbing is if the >> funds raised in the name of GW are used to fund social programs and >> not to reduce GGE. If we go down a similar road in North America I >> hope we find a better way to do it than the UK has demonstrated. > >I doubt it, governments being what they are, but stranger things have >happened. With respect to a GW cash grab I am quite confident we will not be subjected to anything as onerous or as transparently disingenuous as the UK GW road tax cash grab. > >[1] Norway is *not* one of these, incidentally.
From: don (Calgary) on 14 Mar 2010 12:54 On Sun, 14 Mar 2010 16:28:17 +0000, totallydeadmailbox(a)yahoo.co.uk (The Older Gentleman) wrote: >don (Calgary) <hd.flhr(a)telus.net> wrote: > >> On Sun, 14 Mar 2010 10:07:44 +0000, totallydeadmailbox(a)yahoo.co.uk >> (The Older Gentleman) wrote: >> >> > >> > >> >Well, we have an odd vehicle tax system, and Canada (and Virginia, >> >evidently) have another system of screwing money out of motorists. >> >Motorists are easy targets everywhere. >> >> Alberta's system is relatively simple. >> >> New vehicles are subject to a 5% (federal) sales tax. >> >> Used vehicles are subject to a 5% (federal) sales tax, when purchased >> from a dealer. >> >> Used vehicles purchased privately are not subject to a tax. >> >> There is an annual registration fee which costs $75.00 for a car or >> light truck and $45.00 for a motorcycle. >> >> That's it. As far as buying, transferring or registering a vehicle >> that's all there is. > >Simple indeed. Any charges for paperwork changes when (for example) a >vehicle is sold? Not from the government.. The buyer will have to register the vehicle and pay the pro rated balance of the required registration fee. The selller can return their plate and get a refund for the unused balance of their registration fee. As I noted before some dealers will add a document fee to the sale price, but after the first time I got dinged with that fee I have had them back it out of the negotiated purchase price or the deal is dead. We have private vehicle registry centres. Some of those may charge a processing fee to transfer a vehicle. The one I use does not, but I couldn't speak for all of them.
From: The Older Gentleman on 14 Mar 2010 13:05 don (Calgary) <hd.flhr(a)telus.net> wrote: > > > >Name three of comparable size? > > By area or population? The para below makes it clear... >> I can't actually think of any country with an equivalent population to > >the UK's that fits this bill. I expect some small states with massive > >oil revenues manage it[1], but that's hardly representative. > <snip> > > Canada is far from what I would describe as a wealthy country, yet we > do enjoy a universal health care program. Granted we do not have the > population of the UK, but as I noted above the lack of huge population > centres creates our own financial challenges. Regardless once a > country passes a certain population threshold the income/expense > equation tends to balance out. More people equals more income and > increased expenses. I think this is nonsense, actually. A helluva lot depends on the country's basic per capita wealth and income. Which is why I cited Norway (see below). An incredibly rich country due to oil and fish revenues (but mostly oil) and one which is incredibly highly taxed. I still can't think of a country comparable in (population) size to the UK which has a generous social programme that isn't paid for by relatively heavy personal taxation. Something tells me there must be some, but damned if I can think of any. However, since you made the claim I'll leave the research to you :-)) <snip> > With respect to a GW cash grab I am quite confident we will not be > subjected to anything as onerous or as transparently disingenuous as > the UK GW road tax cash grab. <Shrug> Vehicles have been taxed virtually since they were invented and so the great scheme of things, it isn't that much of a grab. Small cars are very lightly taxed - my wife's Nissan is one of them. It's just �35 or about 50 Canadian dollars. And moer economical vehicles are free. Huge gas guzzlers (exotic sports cars, massive limos, that sort of thing) are very heavily taxed, but there are relatively few of them on the roads. > > > >[1] Norway is *not* one of these, incidentally. -- BMW K1100LT Ducati 750SS Honda CB400F Triumph Street Triple Suzuki TS250ER GN250 Damn, back to six bikes! Try Googling before asking a damn silly question. chateau dot murray at idnet dot com
From: The Older Gentleman on 14 Mar 2010 13:07 don (Calgary) <hd.flhr(a)telus.net> wrote: > >Simple indeed. Any charges for paperwork changes when (for example) a > >vehicle is sold? > > Not from the government.. Well, that's what counts. Ours is free, too. > > The buyer will have to register the vehicle and pay the pro rated > balance of the required registration fee. The selller can return their > plate and get a refund for the unused balance of their registration > fee. > > As I noted before some dealers will add a document fee to the sale > price, but after the first time I got dinged with that fee I have had > them back it out of the negotiated purchase price or the deal is dead. > > We have private vehicle registry centres. Some of those may charge a > processing fee to transfer a vehicle. The one I use does not, but I > couldn't speak for all of them. Hm. Nothing like that here. It's all handled by the government department - send in the paperwork, and they send it back. That's it. -- BMW K1100LT Ducati 750SS Honda CB400F Triumph Street Triple Suzuki TS250ER GN250 Damn, back to six bikes! Try Googling before asking a damn silly question. chateau dot murray at idnet dot com
From: don (Calgary) on 14 Mar 2010 13:25
On Sun, 14 Mar 2010 17:07:55 +0000, totallydeadmailbox(a)yahoo.co.uk (The Older Gentleman) wrote: >don (Calgary) <hd.flhr(a)telus.net> wrote: > >> >Simple indeed. Any charges for paperwork changes when (for example) a >> >vehicle is sold? >> >> Not from the government.. > >Well, that's what counts. Ours is free, too. Even areas that have a processing, fee the amount when compared to your road tax is insignificant. >> >> The buyer will have to register the vehicle and pay the pro rated >> balance of the required registration fee. The selller can return their >> plate and get a refund for the unused balance of their registration >> fee. >> >> As I noted before some dealers will add a document fee to the sale >> price, but after the first time I got dinged with that fee I have had >> them back it out of the negotiated purchase price or the deal is dead. >> >> We have private vehicle registry centres. Some of those may charge a >> processing fee to transfer a vehicle. The one I use does not, but I >> couldn't speak for all of them. > >Hm. Nothing like that here. It's all handled by the government >department - send in the paperwork, and they send it back. That's it. And yet you still have that onerous road tax. The cost of that one far exceeds anything we have over here. Do you have to pay sales tax on vehicle purchases, new or used? |